Experimental calendar reconstruction

Dating of the various texts in relation to other sources, archaeology, geology, genetics etc.
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Pax
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Re: Experimental calendar reconstruction

Post by Pax »

I have updated my notes on Easter in the first post. I have also listed the traditional Danish and German month names below, in the style of Jan's traditional Dutch and Flemmish names. I will organise more later; eventually we can create a much more complete overview of “Germanic” month names and compare with the Oera Linda book.

Danish (via Ordbog Over Det Danske Sprog):

January: Glugmaaned (“icehole-fishing month”)
February: Blidemaaned (“brighter month,” also used for March and April)
March: Tor/Thormaaned
April: Faaremaaned
May: Maj, and sometimes Rosenmaaned (“rose month,” also used for June). The verb maje meant to decorate or to bloom; both meanings make sense in the context of the Maypole Festival.
June: Skærsommer
July: Ormemaaned
August: Høstmaaned
September: Fiskemaaned
October: Sædemaaned
November: Slagtemaaned
December: Julemaaned

German (via Duden):

January: Hartmonat/mond, Hartung (= HERDE?)
February: Hornung
March: Lenzing, Lenzmonat/mond
April: Ostermonat/mond, Wandelmonat/mond
May: Weidemonat/mond, Wonnemonat/mond (= WINNA?)
June: Brachet, Brachmonat/mond
July: Heuert, Heuet, Heumonat/mond
August: Erntemonat/mond, Ernting
September: Herbstmonat/mond, Scheiding
October: Gilbhard/hart, Weinmonat/mond
November: Hartmonat (= HERDE?), Nebelmonat/mond, Nebelung (sounds like Nibelung)
December: Hartmonat (= HERDE?), Julmonat/mond
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ott
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Re: Experimental calendar reconstruction

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Pax wrote: 26 Mar 2024, 18:01Also, from which sources did you find the Old Dutch and Flemmish names?
A delayed answer: Wikipedia "Oude Nederlandse maandnamen"
And on Fryskednis blog: TWILIF ~ twelve: a special number
Bjorn_Steinthorsson
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Re: Experimental calendar reconstruction

Post by Bjorn_Steinthorsson »

Maybe an annoying question, but why do we assume 12 months? I know we have 12 now, but 13, 10 and 22 have also been done.
Month might just as well be related to monad? Like unit? The wheel has 6 spokes.

Just an idea, but if you see the sunrise each morning it moves like a pendulum. So you have a beginning, middle and end. The solstices and equinoxes.

1 period of solstice
2 movement from solstice to equinox
3 equinox to solstice
4 period of solstice
5 movement solstice to equinox
6 movement equinox to solstice

6 periods

Just an idea
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ott
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Re: Experimental calendar reconstruction

Post by ott »

Bjorn_Steinthorsson wrote: 04 Apr 2024, 19:40 (...) why do we assume 12 months? (...)
Month might just as well be related to monad? Like unit? The wheel has 6 spokes.
(...) a beginning, middle and end. The solstices and equinoxes.
1 period of solstice
2 movement from solstice to equinox
3 equinox to solstice
4 period of solstice
5 movement solstice to equinox
6 movement equinox to solstice
It's a good question, but it's not easy to distribute the names given in OL over these 6 periods. Six periods may have been even older and could have still be used next to the 12 periods system. OL demonstrates that various names may have been used at the same time by the same people. I did not even know the English word 'monad'! It's just as close to MÔNATH as 'month'. (Must also be the root of 'money') At least deserves a footnote to the translation.
Kraftr wrote: 29 Mar 2024, 20:40 Personally I like the Mayan calender, 13 months makes sense. Moon(month) cycles vs the sun cycle.
Mooncycle may have been very usefull for knowing the (spring)tides.
Not only 13 months, but also cycles of 4, 13, 20 and 260 days. I find that very useful too and have used it (for almost 20 years now) next to the regular calendar.
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Pax
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Re: Experimental calendar reconstruction

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The idea of using two calendars simultaneously is fascinating and something I had not considered. Apparently the Ancient Egyptians did this; the civil calendar for long-term planning was solar, whereas a separate lunar calendar was used for agriculture. Furthermore, I had not fully considered the utility of lunisolar calendars when I wrote my first post. Indeed, it may be wrong to fill the gaps in a fundamentally Julian calendar if historical accuracy is the goal. At the same time, I try to avoid inventing things that are scarcely attested, like Björn's six periods idea, even though I like the idea itself.

A lunisolar calendar is when the reckoning is based on the moon phases, but a leap month is added to the year every 2-3 years to align the calendar with the solar year of about 365.24 days and thus prevent season drift. An entire moon cycle is called a lunar or synodic month, which is an average of 29.53 days, not the average 30.44 days of a Julian month. Solar calendars reckon based on the sun and adjust roughly to fit the timing of lunar events (lunar impact on plant growth, fertility cycles and tides), whereas lunisolar calendars reckon based on the moon and adjust roughly to fit the timing of solar events (solstices and equinoxes).

There are dozens of examples of ancient cultures preferring a lunisolar calendar, probably due to its agricultural utility; in fact, it seems to be the most popular option in ancient civilisations. It is possible that the calendar used by the Fryas was lunisolar, since that would fit Bede's description: 12 months in a regular year, 13 months in a leap (or “embolismic”) year. Assuming this, his account is an accurate picture of Frya months when looking aside from contradicting names like Thrimilchi instead of WINNA.MÔNATH. The leap month was added after the month of summer solstice perhaps to ensure the greatest accuracy of the harvest season and to nicely coincide with the summer solstice festival, which was probably Frya's Day. The Chinese lunisolar calendar also adds the leap month after summer solstice.

Aside: The civil calendar today is an updated version of the solar Julian calendar. Apparently the Romans updated their original 10-month lunar calendar to have 2 more months and a leap month, making it lunisolar; so all the Julian calendar really did was switch to solar reckoning, perhaps due to their veneration of Sol Invictus, their sun god. Laurent Guyénot talks about the importance of Sol in Anno Domini: A Short History of the First Millennium AD:
We are taught that “Caesar” was a cognomen (nickname) of unknown meaning and origin, and that it was adopted immediately after Julius Caesar’s death as imperial title; we are asked to believe, in other words, that the emperors all called themselves Caesar in memory of that general and dictator who was not even emperor, and that the term gained such prestige that it went on to be adopted by Russian “Czars” and German “Kaisers”. But that etymology has long been challenged by those (including Voltaire) who claim that Caesar comes from an Indo-European root word meaning “king”, which also gave the Persian Khosro. These two origins cannot both be true, and the second seems well grounded.

Cesar’s gentilice (surname) Julius does not ease our perplexity. We are told by Virgil that it goes back to Cesar’s supposed ancestor Julus or Jule. But Virgil also tells us (drawing from Cato the Elder, c. 168 BC) that it is the short name of Jupiter (Jul Pater). And it happens to be an Indo-European root word designating the sunlight or the day sky, identical to the Scandinavian name for the solar god, Yule (Helios for the Greeks, Haul for the Gauls, Hel for the Germans, from which derives the French Noël, Novo Hel). Is “Julius Caesar” the “Sun King”?

Consider, in addition, that: 1. Roman emperors were traditionally declared adoptive sons of the sun-god Jupiter or of the “Undefeated Sun” (Sol Invictus). 2. The first emperor, Octavian Augustus, was allegedly the adoptive son of Julius Caesar, whom he divinized under the name Julius Caesar Divus (celebrated on January 1), while renaming in his honor the first month of summer, July. If Augustus is both the adoptive son of the divine Sun and the adoptive son of the divine Julius, and if in addition Julius or Julus is the divine name of the Sun, it means that the divine Julius is none other than the divine Sun (and the so-called “Julian” calendar simply meant the “solar” calendar). Julius Caesar has been brought down from heaven to earth, transposed from mythology to history.

My notes:
Indo-European is a myth. Before it became trendy, Ernst Jäkel showed in 1830 in Der germanische Urspung der lateinischen Sprache that most Latin vocabulary can be traced back to Old High German and Old Saxon. Old High German has keisar, Old Saxon has kēsur, meaning leader or emperor. Old Danish has Kaas, which means fairway (i.e. ship channel) or direction, like German Kurs. Kaas remains a popular Danish, German and Dutch surname. So keisar/kēsur might have come from an original meaning of “ship channel navigator” or “steerer.” English key may also be distantly related; one says the “key person” for example.
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ott
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Re: Experimental calendar reconstruction

Post by ott »

Pax wrote: 06 Apr 2024, 12:53So keisar/kēsur might have come from an original meaning of “ship channel navigator” or “steerer.”
I think it's from KJASAR (lit.: chooser), albeit not in the specific meaning in which it is used in OL.
[022] IS HWA SJVGUN JÉR KJASAR SÁ MÉI HI HELPA EN HÉRMAN JEFTHA KÉNING TO KJASANE.

'Augustus' may be explained as HÁCHST or HÁGEST: 'highest'.

(Julius: JOL; Hera: HÉRA, 'to hear'; Diana: THJANJA, 'to serve'; many examples that make sense.)
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Pax
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Re: Experimental calendar reconstruction

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Those are good etymologies. Fryas KJASAR would have been Old Saxon *kiosar from the verb kiosan, descendant of KJASA. Fryas HÁCHST/HÁGEST would have been Old Saxon hōhost. Later scribes spelt it as hōchost, so the velar sounds [ g ] and [ x ] (the -ch- sound) were pronounced and spelt inconsistently.

This is an aside, but interestingly, in Old Latin, -au- and -u- were sometimes interchanged with -o-, e.g. cōnsol instead of cōnsul, prīmos instead of prīmus, Clōdius instead of Claudius, plōdō instead of plaudō. Old Latin also used C instead of G. So an earlier form of august- was likely *ōcost-. Since [ k ] is also a velar sound, and since Latin often drops the -h- sound, maybe in Northern Italy or Southern Germany the word was *ōchost or *hōchost, closer to Old Saxon and ultimately Fryas. It is fascinating to consider just how young Latin is and how much influence Fryas had on it; Old Latin used Phoenician letters, whereas Standskrift and Runskrift letters appear in the late Republic.

Another aside: *jul (from JOL) is unattested in Old Saxon and Old High German even though it shows up in the traditional month name Julmonat/Julmond. Many forms in Old Saxon, Old High German, Old Frisian, Old English, Old Dutch etc. can be reconstructed with a few sound changes from Fryas, and vice versa, which will be useful in future work on neologisms.
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Re: Experimental calendar reconstruction

Post by ott »

Pax wrote: 30 Mar 2024, 08:26It would also make more sense that Sella Month, or “Buy/Sell Month,” would be in spring, where it is easier to reopen the markets. (Perhaps Jan and Bruce can discuss this wrt. their translation.)
Thanks for the suggestion. We've changed the translation to 'Selling month'.
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