Hello, Greetings all, new member from Australia.

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Pax
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Re: Hello, Greetings all, new member from Australia.

Post by Pax »

teijahn wrote: 19 Dec 2023, 00:56 I am aware of Alewyn Raubeheimer's book, and his extensive research, and am trying to locate a copy of the book, which is proving difficult. I was hoping for a digital version, which doesn't seem to exist.
The book can be purchased on Amazon.
ott wrote: 19 Dec 2023, 06:04 Pax, can you add the fragment(s) where this would be suggested?
Throughout the book, dates are reckoned relative to the sinking of Aldland. It would be strange for the Fryas to reckon time relative to the demise of the land of a foreign people.

In 7b, the sinking of Aldland is described. It would be strange to devote so much wistful prose to the sinking of a foreign people's land, especially one hated by the Fryas. Aldland and “the lands of Finda” are mentioned separately. The R1a haplogroup — comprising many of the Findas — seems to originate from the Altai Mountains, which is not an island that can sink.

In 8c, Inka, who had had enough of the Findas, ventured out into the Atlantic Ocean in search of Aldland, where the old island of Frisland would have been located. Surely he would not attempt such a mission if he had the slightest suspicion that some Findas might live there.

In 3c, Aldland is referred to as the homeland of the Findas, lying under the sea and being far away. Lying under the sea does not fit with their origin being the Asian steppes, so I think submersion was an assumption, since it was described as far away and thus not something the Fryas could confirm. The Fryas had seen many lands sink and rise, forcing their exodus from their own Aldland, so they figured that this was also the reason that waves of Findas invaded Fryasland.
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ott
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Re: Hello, Greetings all, new member from Australia.

Post by ott »

Pax wrote: 19 Dec 2023, 14:21It would be strange for the Fryas to reckon time relative to the demise of the land of a foreign people.
The 'bad times' were an Earth-wide event, with the sinking of Aldland as its (apparant) most significant geological change. As this sinking resulted in invasions of Finda people, it will have been relevant enough to start counting years using that as reference. We don't know if the counting system was (originally) only used by the Fryas.
In 7b, the sinking of Aldland is described. It would be strange to devote so much wistful prose to the sinking of a foreign people's land (...) Aldland and “the lands of Finda” are mentioned separately.
The chapter title may have to be changed as it is about how the 'bad times' came, from which Aldlands sinking was one event and not described with that much detail. Even when they had not lived there themselves, thre Fryas must have been fascinated by the total disappearance of an (apparent) large landmass. [049/32] THA LANDA FINDAS may well refer to [049/25] ALDLAND. THRVCH THA STJÛRAR ÁTLAND HÉTEN, which is how I read it.
In 8c, Inka, who had had enough of the Findas, ventured out into the Atlantic Ocean in search of Aldland (...) Surely he would not attempt such a mission if he had the slightest suspicion that some Findas might live there.
He will not have been a coward. If he would have found (too many) Finda's there, they might have left again with valuable information. But if some land had risen back again, now unpopulated, it might have treasure and good land to settle on.
In 3c, Aldland is referred to as the homeland of the Findas (...)
It says: Finda’s folk lived mostly together in their mother’s native land — called ‘Aldland’. So groups may have lived elsewhere.

In Oera Linda, there is no direct mention of the Fryas having come from Aldland themselves (but it is possible to have theories why they would have). Rather, (part of) the land that sank when Frya went to her 'watch-star' was named Fleeland (FLÍLÁND).
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Pax
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Re: Hello, Greetings all, new member from Australia.

Post by Pax »

Thank you for the note on “mostly.” That said, in my hypothesis, the R1a-haplogroup Findas would also have mostly lived near the Altai Mountains.

I forgot to mention this detail, but only the Fryas had the skills and means to fare on Wralda's Sea (see 07a); the Findas, at least the Magyars, were mainly horseriders. Coincidentally, Asha Logos recently created a video on the Scythians, who are likely related (link). The Oera Linda book and especially the Geartmen are never mentioned, but the Frisian horse is.

The Oera Linda book indeed never says that the Fryas lived on or in Aldland, but depending on one's interpretation, it is implied. By the time the text in chapter 07a was written, Aldland was a distant memory, hence the name and sparse details about it.

I think Fleeland was in Europe in any case, probably related to Vlieland like you suggest on the wiki; the name itself could suggest it is where Frya (if she is historical) and her contingent fled to after the sinking of Aldland. Then, a second natural disaster would have followed, causing part of Fleeland to sink. The Dutch coast has a long history of dealing with sinking landmasses.

I think it is possible to argue persuasively for both hypotheses concerning Aldland. My suggestion depends on data beyond the book, namely about the R1a haplogroup and the ancient island of Frisland in the Atlantic Ocean.
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