Hello, Greetings all, new member from Australia.

[teijahn]

I first encountered the Oera Linda Book about 40 years ago, was fascinated with it then and have remained so, finding myself now that I am retired with time to explore further. I will be for now working with a Sandbach translation and Robert Scruttons version, tho I undertand some have lack of confidence in the Sandbach translation..
My biggest query is the time frame, the book giving a clear date of the inundation by floodwaters yet "experts?" would have that the location was underwater some thousands of years earlier. If anyone can direct me to prior posts or other links that may have explored this aspect of the country's history I would be grateful.


Cheers for now
Teijahn

[Helgiteut]

Goodbye mate, it's good to have you here. Could you be clear which land you are talking about being flooded?

[teijahn]

The land that existed thousands of years ago as an extension of the now Netherlands and German coastline (between Britain and Denmark) that is defined as Atland in the Oera Linda book. That which according to the book was submerged in 2193 BC but which geologists say was underwater 4000 years earlier.

[Helgiteut]

I understand now. The thing is, the book doesn't say that Atland was near the Netherlands. That's a idea a lot of people have, because they think the frisians came from Atlantis. I'll add a link to a word study that Jan Ott has done. https://wiki.oeralinda.org/view/ALDLAND
I'd you have a look you'll see a quote from the text saying that:
1. Atland is the homeland of the Findas
2. Atland was far away.
I understand things get murkey because a lot of the people that mention this book, they add a lot of their own ideas into the explanation. If you disagree though, I'm happy to hear your side of it.

[teijahn]

I understand now. The thing is, the book doesn't say that Atland was near the Netherlands. That's a idea a lot of people have, because they think the frisians came from Atlantis. I'll add a link to a word study that Jan Ott has done. https://wiki.oeralinda.org/view/ALDLAND
I'd you have a look you'll see a quote from the text saying that:
1. Atland is the homeland of the Findas
2. Atland was far away.
I understand things get murkey because a lot of the people that mention this book, they add a lot of their own ideas into the explanation. If you disagree though, I'm happy to hear your side of it.

Thank you for the link, I have spent some time on it, but can't reconcile the comments with the view I explain below. Is it proposed that the location was in the Mediterranean?. Has anyone established where Finda's land was, presumably Asian?

For me, it seems very clear from the quoted extract from the "Before the Badtimes" (Jan Ott version) section below, that Atland was then bordering now Germany and Netherlands including area as far southwest as the Scheldt, elsewhere is mentioned habitation as far east as the Weser river in now Germany. Wraldas sea would be the open sea to the north, and the gates of the Middle Sea here would be likely describing the passage between the south east coast of then Britain and the north west european coastline. What doesnt fit neatly is the reference to the near Greeklands and Libya (Lydia).

However from as well as other references within the book, it is conclusive that the coastline and islands from at least the Weser River as far south as at least the then mouth of the Scheldt River, including as indicated the Rhine River, form part of the then Atland. In the Sandbach version he references in this section the Mediterranean Sea, which provides further confusion to add to the Krekalander (Greek) and Libya refences.

I am also clear from considerable research on other "lost" civilizations that the Atlantis connection many have made is incorrect, being located much further south with the Azore islands being a northern remnant. As well at this stage of my understanding, I am unable to join the dots to references to the Mediterranean and Libyan cultures. They would have been sailing roughly 5000 ks from Atland to reach Greece, Crete and Libya, and a further 1000 ks to Phoenicia.

Maybe its the mixed chronology that creates confusion, however I can't see how its other than that the Weser-Scheldt region I've indicated formed at least part of then Atland, regardless of where the other noted locations fit in to the puzzle.


""On one side, we were enclosed by Wralda’s Sea, upon which no folk but us had the means nor skills to fare; on the other side, we were hedged by the broad Twiskland, through which the Finda folk dared not come, on account of the thick forests and the wild beasts. Toward the sunrise, our borders reached to the utmost limits of the East Sea; toward sunset, [2] to the gates of the Middle Sea. Thus, we had — in addition to the smaller ones — no fewer than twelve great freshwater rivers given us by Wralda to keep our land healthy and to show our adventurous folk the way to his sea.

The banks of these rivers were almost entirely inhabited by our folk, [048] as were the plains and the whole Rhine from beginning to end. Opposite the Denmarks and the Jutterland, [3] we had colonies with a burgmaid, whence we obtained copper and iron, plus tar, pitch, and some other necessities. Opposite our former Westland, we had Britannia with its tin mines (Britannia was the land of the banished, who were ‘brit’ away with the help of their burgmaid to spare their lives. But in order that they should never come back, a ‘B’ was first tattooed on their foreheads; murderers with blood-red dye and other criminals with blue dye).

Furthermore, our steersmen and traders had many warehouses in the Near Greeklands and in Lydia. (In Lydia is where the black people live.)

As our land was so great and extensive, we had many different names: Those who lived in the east of the Denmarks were called ‘Jutters’, because almost all they did was to ‘jut’ (or: collect) amber on the shores. Those who lived on the islands were called ‘Lets’ (or: ‘the Absent’), because they mostly lived in remote locations.[4]

All inhabitants of beaches and shores, from the Denmarks to the Sandfal — now Scheldt — were called ‘Stiurar’ (steersmen), ‘Seakampar’ (sea campaigners) and ‘Angelara’ (fishermen). Angelara was the name given chiefly to the fishermen at sea, because they fished only with an ‘angle’, or pole, [049] and never used nets. [5] Those who lived further off, down to the Near Greeklands, were simply called ‘Kaedhomer’ (coast-dwellers), because they never fared out to sea. Those who lived in the highmarks that border the Twisklands were called ‘Saxmen’, because they were always armed (with a ‘sax’: knife) against the wild animals and the savage ‘Brits’ (banished). Moreover, we had the names ‘Land-dwellers’, ‘Lake-dwellers’, and ‘Holt-’ or ‘Wood-dwellers’.""

[Helgiteut]

Your quotes are about the Fryas. They are indeed in the north Sea. We don't know where atland was, but the Findas, from atland, show up in around Sweden or Finland after Atland sinks. So it could be in the Baltic, or somewhere in the arctic ocean. It could also be the black sea. But remember those quotes about the names of people from the scheldt to the middle sea, that is about the Fryas/Fryans (native europeans) not the Findas (from Atland, mostly living in Asia afterwards)

[Coco]

The geographical location of Aldland is not without contradiction, for it is described as both the historical Frya homeland and the origin of the Findas. The term "Aldland" has been observed to refer to multiple locations depending on the context: the Frya Aldland in the Atlantic Ocean, potentially on the ancient island of Frisland, of which only the Faeroe Islands remain (Fae-roe = Phae-acia = Frei-asland); and the Finda Aldland, possibly near the Altai Mountains, whence the Magyars originated. This topic is explored in greater detail by Alewyn J. Raubenheimer in his book Chronicles from Pre-Celtic Europe, which may be of interest to readers.

[teijahn]

William Sandbach translated Jan Gehardus Ottema's Dutch translation of the Oera Linda book. So Sandbach's work is a translation of a translation. This produces a bad result, as information gets lost in translation. Jan Ott and more recently Bruce Stafford are producing a direct English translation, and Jan himself is fluent in Fryas, the language in the book. You can read the latest version of the translation on the Oera Linda wiki.

The location of Aldland is contradictory, because on the one hand, it is described as the old Frya homeland, and on the other, it is referred to as the origin of the Findas. “Aldland” might have referred to multiple places depending on the context: the Frya Aldland in the Atlantic Ocean, possibly on the ancient island of Frisland of which only the Faeroe Islands remain (Fae-roe = Phae-acia = Frei-asland); and the Finda Aldland, possibly near the Altai Mountains, whence came the Magyars. Alewyn J. Raubenheimer explores this topic in his book Chronicles from Pre-Celtic Europe (3rd edition, 2014), which may interest you.

Thank You for the link. Yes I also am finding seeming contradictions, and perhaps your suggestion of Aldland describing multiple locations may be correct, but if Atland/Aldland translates as many have it to the Oldland, that would occur to me as a specific place/location. I am aware of Alewyn Raubeheimer's book, and his extensive research, and am trying to locate a copy of the book, which is proving difficult. I was hoping for a digital version, which doesn't seem to exist.

[ott]

Welcome to the forum, Teijahn.

(...) it is described as both the historical Frya homeland (...) the Frya Aldland in the Atlantic Ocean (...)

Coco, can you add the fragment(s) where this would be suggested?

[teijahn]

Welcome to the forum, Teijahn.

Thank You. I have been referencing the sequential chronology available in the wiki, I find it work well done and quite useful in attempting to clarify my understanding of the story told.